• Cyburbia is a friendly big tent, where we share our experiences and thoughts about urban planning practice, the built environment, planning adjacent topics, and anything else that comes to mind. No ads, no spam, and it's free. It's easy to join!

NEVERENDING ♾️ The NEVERENDING Political Discussion Thread

So when Trump manages to screw the economy (early evidence is already starting to show up), he has absolutely no cushion of goodwill. That will be the point that his loyalists start looking up and realize they've been had. That will likely manifest first in the heartland due to the revenge tariffs that have targeted agricultural product exports from the U.S. Tack on this crazy immigration stuff that will impact farm labor as well as construction, and you start to realize a ticking time bomb hidden beneath Trump's hair.

I agree this is key. The second we see the stock market correct itself (say 8000+ point drop) and businesses stop hiring, Trump is toast. I mean what exactly he is planning on running on in 2020? That he dropped out of the UN Council of Human Rights? That he split immigrant families up? That he created a Space Force?

If he doesn't have the economy, he has nothing. His ability to lead and get a coalition of any group together to get things done is pretty clearly terrible. He may think he is a leader, but he has yet to lead. His tone works with his base, but only because they think he is changing something. That is wearing off fast, and it looks like he not only is just a typical Washington politician, but he is also really bad at leading the free world. His best international friends right now are Israel and Guatemala. I mean seriously.

Ugh.
 
The United States of America just dropped out of the UN Council on Human Rights.

I never thought I would read this statement and for it to be true.





There's your reality show cliffhanger.
Will tRump double down on his anger?
Will Ivanka soothe her daddy's cold heart?
Will Paul Ryan introduce a 3rd or 4th Immigration Bill that he knows won't go anywhere?
Which administration member will yell at reporters?
Stay tuned today for more...
 
I agree this is key. The second we see the stock market correct itself (say 8000+ point drop) and businesses stop hiring, Trump is toast. I mean what exactly he is planning on running on in 2020? That he dropped out of the UN Council of Human Rights? That he split immigrant families up? That he created a Space Force?

If he doesn't have the economy, he has nothing. His ability to lead and get a coalition of any group together to get things done is pretty clearly terrible. He may think he is a leader, but he has yet to lead. His tone works with his base, but only because they think he is changing something. That is wearing off fast, and it looks like he not only is just a typical Washington politician, but he is also really bad at leading the free world. His best international friends right now are Israel and Guatemala. I mean seriously.

Ugh.

I agree. There are so many people who I know who voted for him because they could not stand Hillary and still say that he was the lesser of the two evils, but are not sure if they could vote for him again.

Personally, I am so frustrated with the entire system. I mean the level of corruption, deceit, greed, and a unquenchable quest for power on both sides is tearing this country apart. I fear that it is only going to get worse because too many people are unwilling to demand better when it comes time to vote. We have politicians where we need statesman.
 
Does anyone see the irony of DHS Secretary Nielsen going to a Mexican restaurant for dinner after she made her dramatic separating kids at the Mexican border speech?

Is anyone surprised that she got heckled and only stayed 10 minutes?

Can she really be that stupid / clueless or was she just giving the proverbial middle finger to all?
 
I agree. There are so many people who I know who voted for him because they could not stand Hillary and still say that he was the lesser of the two evils, but are not sure if they could vote for him again.

I abstained from voting for the President. I couldn't bring myself to cast a vote for either candidate. I'm still not certain if I regret this decision or not. I'm certain Hilary was the lesser of two evils, but she was equally corrupt. The only thing she would have brought is civility to the role and respect for our allies that Trump has largely disposed of.

Does anyone see the irony of DHS Secretary Nielsen going to a Mexican restaurant for dinner after she made her dramatic separating kids at the Mexican border speech?

Is anyone surprised that she got heckled and only stayed 10 minutes?

Can she really be that stupid / clueless or was she just giving the proverbial middle finger to all?

I can't fathom exactly what would drive a person to do this. Granted most "Mexican restaurants" out there are hardly traditional Mexican, yet the staff is still largely of Hispanic origin.

Simply put, I can't get the logic that is behind the debate of illegal immigration. Does anyone really think that a person would completely uproot their entire life to come to a country illegally just on a whim? Illegal immigrants constantly feel hunted, a life of looking over their shoulder where ever they go. Who the hell wants that? I'm dating a Mexican woman, born in the States but from parents who came from Mexico as far as I know. I don't know if they came legally, and I don't give two shits personally. They contribute, their kids contribute, so why does it matter? There was a reason they felt they needed to come here. Our responsibility should be to A) overhaul the immigration program so that it doesn't take freaking decades and 10k to become a citizen, and B) understand WHY these people are fleeing and see what international aid we can give those countries to stop it at it's source. No one wants to leave their home unless it's an absolutely dire circumstance.
 
Does anyone see the irony of DHS Secretary Nielsen going to a Mexican restaurant for dinner after she made her dramatic separating kids at the Mexican border speech?

Is anyone surprised that she got heckled and only stayed 10 minutes?

Can she really be that stupid / clueless or was she just giving the proverbial middle finger to all?

"You might want to avoid the refried beans, Madame Secretary."

:r:
 
What's sad is all the vitriol that is directed at Trump for this. It completely misses the point. Sure he's a blowhard and all that. But this is not his making. In fact in the long run he should probably be thanked because it's showing that we currently have is an incoherent, unenforceable immigration policy. The whole illegal immigration issue is a shit show decades in the making. 25 years ago the Republicans didn't give a damn about it because cheap labor was exploited by business interests. And at that time the Dems were bitching about it because it was suppressing union and blue collar wage growth. Now that the R's have made some inroads with those folks they don't like illegal immigration and the Dems can't accommodate illegals fast enough because it now serves their political ideology.

DHS only enforces laws enacted by Congress. Last I checked we're supposed to be a nation of laws, not selective enforcement of certain ones. If it's a bad law, change the MF-ing law!!! Obama challenged Congress to take on the issue and had no takers because of partisanship but the fallout wasn't that big of a deal because they essentially kept the status quo.

You can look back through this thread over the years and I've continually said the same thing about the President. Whoever it is. If you want change, real change, look at Congress. We as a nation re-elect a staggering number of incumbents. They are the ones we should all be super pissed at. They've had decades to deal with this and chose not to. That's why gasbags like Chuck Schumer can go take a flying leap when he says shit like DT could end this "with a flick of a pen". He's had years! But doing your job doesn't really get you anything in Congress. F all of them!
 
What's sad is all the vitriol that is directed at Trump for this. It completely misses the point. Sure he's a blowhard and all that. But this is not his making. In fact in the long run he should probably be thanked because it's showing that we currently have is an incoherent, unenforceable immigration policy. The whole illegal immigration issue is a shit show decades in the making. 25 years ago the Republicans didn't give a damn about it because cheap labor was exploited by business interests. And at that time the Dems were bitching about it because it was suppressing union and blue collar wage growth. Now that the R's have made some inroads with those folks they don't like illegal immigration and the Dems can't accommodate illegals fast enough because it now serves their political ideology.

DHS only enforces laws enacted by Congress. Last I checked we're supposed to be a nation of laws, not selective enforcement of certain ones. If it's a bad law, change the MF-ing law!!! Obama challenged Congress to take on the issue and had no takers because of partisanship but the fallout wasn't that big of a deal because they essentially kept the status quo....!

The law does not mandate that children must be separated from their families upon illegal entry. The law is that those crossing the border illegally shall be prosecuted. Previously, the official DHS/ICE policy was to issue bond and prosecute in civil court which allowed parents to remain with their children while awaiting trial while DHS also remained in compliance with the law. The law has not changed but the current administration updated their policy to move those trials to criminal court and to no longer issue bond in most cases. Because the adults are now being held (instead of released on bond) in facilities that cannot also hold their children they are therefore separated. The administration could have kept the previous policy in place and they wouldn't have the issue of the separations. Prosecutors at all levels of government and all jurisdictions have prosecutorial discretion to decide which level to prosecute crimes at and which cases to even bring to court. This has been true since the founding of the country. We are a nation of laws but there has always been room for interpretation, leniency, or compassion.

Further, during the run-up to the shutdown last year the President met with leaders from the House and Senate and in a televised meeting said that if they brought an immigration bill to him, no matter what it was, he would sign it. One of the House members even asked if he would sign a clean immigration bill (referring to just dealing with DACA, IIRC, and not attaching any specific border wall or other funding to it) and he again said he would sign it. A group of senators then began working on a bill only to give up a week or so later when word came out of the White House that Trump would refuse to sign any immigration or DACA bill that did not specifically include funding for his wall. Between episodes like this and the pulling out of treaties and trade deals he has shown that he is not somebody who you can put a lot of faith in in terms of "making deals."

I would agree that there needs to be some sort of change in the immigration process (I would like to see it easier for folks to come here legally and become productive members of society) and that existing laws should be enforced but there is room within the existing laws to have policies that aren't so barbaric. What's happening today and the bad press that the President and the current administration are getting is entirely their own doing.
 
understand WHY these people are fleeing and see what international aid we can give those countries to stop it at it's source. No one wants to leave their home unless it's an absolutely dire circumstance.

This is complicated because each latin american country is so different. I will take El Salvador, and my family there as a micro experiment of conditions. You think america is the have's and have not's? Try latin america. My family primarily consists of doctors on my mom's side and business entrepreneurs on my father's side. El Salvador's economy is directly tied with the United States. Their official currency is the dollar. When they did this back in 2001ish this exacturbated the worsening poverty. The Country has a minimum wage of $300 per month. Yup, you read that right, $300 per month. From that one must pay for food, shelter, etc. Now, if you are educated, i.e. college degree, you are better off than most because you have a decent wage, but pretty much 90% of the country is not. Additionally, portions of the country a run by gangs. These portions aren't in the any of the tourist areas as the Government, run by leftist socialists, try to put on a good face and have provided stepped up enforcement and clean-up efforts, thus forcing gangs like MS-13 to the very outer ex-urbs of the capital, where they have bought off many government officials, and in additional regions where the police and government are more hands off. These gangs were started by the convicts, we as a country, sent back to El Salvador. These gangs take cuts from local businesses for "protection". So what little you make, you get taken away. Additionally, for "security" you also have to pay these gangs to protect your shit. So again, if you are working a minimum wage job, paying the equivalent of $1.87 an hour, to just give up what little you earn to a gang for protection, there ins't much to live for.

Now, you may ask yourself, wait, this is prime country for investment? You are insanely correct. Let's take Uber. Uber has come into the country ans super convenient for a person like my mom and myself whom have means, but when it is simplistic to get a ride now, quarters on the dollar, how much is the driver making? Well I asked my cousin, who Ubers as his job, and guess what? It's 300 a month. No matter how much he drives, he gets the basic minimum wage. I then asked if he could do something else for more money. The answer, not without an education (i.e. college degree). And unlike the states, uber doesn't automatically give "tipping" as an option, therefore a $1 or 2 tip puts a huge smile on a driver's face. So what is uber doing? Essentially wrecking the taxi driver / bus driver jobs (bus drivers own their own buses outright and run them independently, it's like a loose network of independent contractors). American companies see an emerging market and pillage at cheap wages and maximum profit through a middle class that doesn't really grow but rather inherit and maintain wealth through un-spoken "class system" (as a side note, my first gf, salvadoreno, was from a poorer family, therefore my folks didn't really like her because she was not part of the middle class / wealthy class like themselves).

So as a person, with little to no job opportunities, starting a family or trying to survive with a family, innate natural human tendencies kick in to feed, and better your family when there is no "safety net" aside from basic public education and basic basic health care. You look for opportunities elsewhere. The US, with a minimum wage of $10 plus an hour, or more, and generally in farm labor, can earn up to if not more than $100 during harvest season, looks awful tempting when faced with a minimum wage of $300 per day, even with all the hardships to get here illegally, you do what you need to do.

In no way am I advocating illegal immigration. My mom came here on a student visa. My dad came here on a regular green card. This was the early 1960's and times were different. Getting a visa to even visit people in the states is really really hard. Going through the Visa process with my cousin to allow her to visit with her son, I have had to provide info such as yearly income, etc. Currently our unemployment rate is at 3.5% in my county, and finding people to do basic jobs is virtually impossible. My GF's father commented that is ridiculously hard to find a line cook and bus boy for his restaurant. No one wants those jobs, or quit after a week or so because the wages just aren't there to sustain a business. Americans need to realize we are no longer a manufacturing based economy, but rather a service based economy. Simple answers such as "raise minimum wage" are complicated at best. Our immigration system already tilts to eurocentric skews towards taking legal immigrants with needed "manufacturing skills". Walls, amnesty, etc is not an answer, but comprehensive reform of our system that aligns to our economic realities is really what our country needs, as well as those willing to roll up their sleeves and better their economic situation.
 
"It's all the fault of congress. I hate this law but my hands are tied and there's nothing I can do until congress passes a law for me to sign."

"I'm signing this executive order so that I can stop this horrible policy and keep families together."


I'm paraphrasing but still... :r:


Thankfully somebody convinced him to try to put an end to the practice before photos from the "tender age facilities" started to leak. The administration realized that the inevitable optics of infants and babies and toddlers being detained away from their parents would be too much even for a president willing to use the most vulnerable as pawns to try to leverage his agenda.
 
14 times the administration contradicted itself.



First it was a deterrent. Then it wasn’t.

It was a new Justice Department policy. Then it wasn’t.

It's the Democrats fault. Then it wasn't.

The Trump administration was simply following the law. Then it said separations weren’t required by law.

It could not be reversed by executive order. Then it was.
 
When did the regulation or policy regarding separation of families get adopted? Was it Trump that made this policy or someone else?
 
It's been a law for a while. Everybody acts like this is an easy fix and it's not. You need to look up the Flores Agreement. It's illegal to detain minors as long as it takes to process the adults. What's the answer? To just let them in and say the hell with it? I don't think that's the way to go. The executive order isn't worth the paper it's written on. The Obama administration tried to change the agreement and now this new order is. But if the federal judge wouldn't do it for the previous president he sure isn't going to do it for this one.

At this point I think there are 3 choices:

1. Send everybody back caught entering illegally right away, even if they're claiming "asylum", which will cause a massive shitstorm.
2. Change or violate the Flores Agreement, which probably isn't going to happen.
3. Declare and open border and just let anybody waltz right in.

And Obama pretty much did No. 1 once the federal courts ended his administration's use of family detention centers (as per the Flores Agreement). He deported a ton of people but the media didn't say boo about that. We have a serious, serious illegal immigration crisis and it goes far beyond DT. And I'm not taking up for the guy at all, he's a complete boob but as they say the chickens are coming home to roost on yet another issue that our career politicians have refused to deal with for decades.
 
I suppose we could try working with the countries of origin of these migrants to help them eradicate the gang elements and help shore up their economies so that folks, you know, might not have to leave to come here. You know, instead of calling them shithole countries, and all that.:not:
 
This is complicated because each latin american country is so different. I will take El Salvador, and my family there as a micro experiment of conditions.

Thank you for posting that. I think my statement and your response is very indicative of a large problem in America, which is simply ignorance of other countries and cultures as a whole.
 
This is the kind of shit that makes liberals look like idiots. Gee, a lot of tolerance shown there. Sanders doesn't make law or policy. She does her job and then she goes out to eat and gets treated like that for no particular reason. If we can't treat people civilly when we disagree with their politics we are all screwed. "Do as I say and not as I do" I guess is the mantra now.
 
BizarroOzPoliticsWB.png
 
Sanders says she was kicked out of restaurant because she works for Trump
https://www.politico.com/story/2018/06/23/sanders-trump-restaurant-booted-667179

Have you ever been kicked out of a restaurant or bar because of you job - code enforcement / zoning admin ?

Yes... once, but it was a convenience store as part of a gas station. It was not because of actions against the gas station, but against the person working behind the counter. I wanted to pick up a cup of coffee and the clerk had just received a ticket for not correcting modifications made to their structure despite being denied.
 
This is the kind of shit that makes liberals look like idiots. Gee, a lot of tolerance shown there. Sanders doesn't make law or policy. She does her job and then she goes out to eat and gets treated like that for no particular reason. If we can't treat people civilly when we disagree with their politics we are all screwed. "Do as I say and not as I do" I guess is the mantra now.

Let’s not pretend like this is something new. Democratic leaders are condemning the action but do you remember when some dumbass cookie store kicked Joe Biden out and refused to serve him and not only did republican leaders not condemn the owners but they invited them to rallies and spoke about then as true patriots. You tell me what is more idiotic.
 
Let’s not pretend like this is something new. Democratic leaders are condemning the action but do you remember when some dumbass cookie store kicked Joe Biden out and refused to serve him and not only did republican leaders not condemn the owners but they invited them to rallies and spoke about then as true patriots. You tell me what is more idiotic.

#whataboutism
 
I'm not sure imaplanner's post qualifies as whataboutism. Had he said "Oh yeah, whatabout when the GOP tried to defund PBS and take away Mr. Rogers and Sesame Street from the kids." That would be classic whataboutism. The essence of whataboutism is that the speaker offers no defense to a charge but rather just makes an automatic countercharge. In this instance he did provide a defense - that democratic leaders have condemned the action - and provided an apples for apples countercharge. That's my take anyway.
 
I'm not sure imaplanner's post qualifies as whataboutism. Had he said "Oh yeah, whatabout when the GOP tried to defund PBS and take away Mr. Rogers and Sesame Street from the kids." That would be classic whataboutism. The essence of whataboutism is that the speaker offers no defense to a charge but rather just makes an automatic countercharge. In this instance he did provide a defense - that democratic leaders have condemned the action - and provided an apples for apples countercharge. That's my take anyway.

"...but do you remember when" is classic whataboutism. Not a slight on our fine fellow poster imaplanner, just an observation.
 
Plus it's a stupid freaking childish argument. Wrong is wrong. And just because somebody else did it doesn't make it right. Somebody has to be the grownup in this country. Adults bitch about the kids in this country and yet they behave as though they don't have a modicum of restraint, let alone respect.
 
What are your thoughts regarding the primaries from last night?

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/27/nyregion/alexandria-ocasio-cortez.html

I AM STOKED THAT MY GRRL ALEXANDRIA WON IN THE BRONX AND QUEENS!!! She is also a fellow Democratic Socialist of America.

This is a major victory for the people of the Bronx, for Queens/Bronx Latino's, and really for all New Yorkers. Through grassroots organizing we beat the machine! Im optimistic on this.

#AllPowertothePeople
 
I kind of hope this is a wake up call to both parties. We want something different from our politicians, hence tRump was elected, but that's not what we're looking for and it's not about R or D. It's about getting an honest person in the seat with real ideas and the ability to think for themselves and not along party lines. At the same time it was just a primary so, meh.
 
I kind of hope this is a wake up call to both parties. We want something different from our politicians, hence tRump was elected, but that's not what we're looking for and it's not about R or D. It's about getting an honest person in the seat with real ideas and the ability to think for themselves and not along party lines. At the same time it was just a primary so, meh.

I agree 100%. The best way to hit the reset button on the federal government is to elect new people with new ideas.
 
I kind of hope this is a wake up call to both parties. We want something different from our politicians, hence tRump was elected, but that's not what we're looking for and it's not about R or D. It's about getting an honest person in the seat with real ideas and the ability to think for themselves and not along party lines. At the same time it was just a primary so, meh.
At the very local level here in my City, our Council had a vacancy that they appointed a 31 year old male to. I know...male...but as we all know people seldom get interested in being part of local government until 40+.

It'll be interesting.
 
I guess I am more interested in future policy outcomes than individual candidate victories. And while a specific candidate may vote a certain way on various issues, there's not necessarily a positive correlation there. A sizeable percentage of the electorate does not appreciate the difference between a political issue and a bill.
 
What are your thoughts regarding the primaries from last night?

Joe Crowley's loss to Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez is a fascinating study in old school retail campaign tactics trumping campaign funding. It is increasingly apparent on the Democrat side that, at least in some instances, PAC affiliation can become a liability, whereas a lean & ferocious campaign staff that inspires grassroots is the ultimate asset. Crowley was also badly out of practice in meaningful campaigning, and had lost touch with his community. I mean, he sent a f'n surrogate to a primary debate?!? This happens when elected officials obtain leadership positions in Congress or get too aspirational--they open up a weakness to challenge. I've read discussions regarding Paul Ryan that forecast his potential loss in general election for this reason--perception within his district that his loyalty was elsewhere rather than his constituents. It is exactly what happened to Eric Cantor. It is what I think is about to happen to Ted Cruz, ironically with Beto O'Rourke using a juiced version of Cruz's own retail campaign against him.

These young up & comers are showing real moxy in their campaigns. My operating theory is that this is a product of the gig economy (which requires marketing yourself & a lot of bootstrapping) and millennials being experts in marketing based on authenticity. If you are in your upper 30s or younger, you tend to be skeptical of anything that feels forced or contrived--it sets off alarm bells that the person is inauthentic and not to be trusted. This is a product of us being so heavily marketed at for our entire lives.

------------------

I think the owner of the Red Hen missed an opportunity to raise the conversation, although I respect an owner that sticks up for her employees' wishes. The Red Hen did not advertise that they did this--it was 100% Sanders snowflaking it because this administration lacks the thick skin necessary to be effective. The Biden bakery incident, in contrast, was blown up by the owner who then became a somewhat unwitting tool for the GOP.

Here's what I think the Red Hen owner should have done: Offered Sanders a free meal, but ask that she spend 10-15 minutes listening to the concerns of her staff (with the owner selecting the staff members). That type of request is reasonable, recognizes the feelings of her employees, promotes listening and is in-line with what a holder of a high-exposure public relations position should expect even when "off duty." But Red Hen's actions may depend on the perception of Sanders by her employees.

Given the actions of the administration, her employees could have reasonably viewed Sanders presence as fostering a hostile environment on the basis of her representation of a perceived racist administration. A number of my minority friends have expressed that they view the administration in that manner, to the point that they have concerns about family members or themselves being stripped of citizenship because they are naturalized rather than born here and disregard for due process in ways not unlike the Jim Crow era. For perspective, as a restaurant manager I asked a customer with a visible white supremacist tattoo to leave on the basis of such visible message creating a hostile environment. I would not have taken that approach with Sanders, but I can see where someone would draw such a conclusion.
 
As I stated many times I'm no fan of this administration but I don't think Sanders was being a snowflake. She was trying to go out to eat. If I go someplace and they won't serve me because of where I work then FU, I'm telling people about it too. The D's can't keep bitching about intolerance on the right and then serve up the same intolerance themselves. Man I'm glad to be proudly unaffiliated with either party these days.
 
As I stated many times I'm no fan of this administration but I don't think Sanders was being a snowflake. She was trying to go out to eat. If I go someplace and they won't serve me because of where I work then FU, I'm telling people about it too. The D's can't keep bitching about intolerance on the right and then serve up the same intolerance themselves. Man I'm glad to be proudly unaffiliated with either party these days.

Just for discussion sake, do you think it is ok for a Cake Maker to not provide a cake to a same sex couple? Do you think it is ok for a restaurant to deny service to someone because of their political affiliation?


On a side note, someone just told me about the "Fare Share" decision that SCOTUS handed down. I think it is the right call. It was required that I join a union as part of my first job. There was not one good thing and the bad went beyond the fees.
 
Just for discussion sake, do you think it is ok for a Cake Maker to not provide a cake to a same sex couple? Do you think it is ok for a restaurant to deny service to someone because of their political affiliation?
.

No I don't think it's ok. In either case. One group is protected by law but the other (the restaurant deal) is not. My point is that if you're the party that is supposedly built upon tolerance to then turn around and deny service to someone because of where they work is childish, petty and makes you look incredibly intolerant yourself. I thought the answer to your questions was pretty evident in my initial post.
 
Here's my problem with the whole cake argument. I tend to look at businesses as just that. A business. I don't care that it's a owner operated small business or a corporation. My problem is that they are denying service on "religious" grounds. How does a business have religion? Is Jebus going to save them? (sorry for the almost blasphemy) If you as an employee, manager, or whatever feel you can't serve a person because of your religion then get someone else to do it or don't start a business where you might actually have to serve people you don't like.

Same goes for the restaurant. Suck it up people. I hate the lady, but she just wanted dinner. Now if there was more to the story like she was causing a scene of some kind then get the F out of my restaurant. If it was going to create some kind of public nuisance then get out. Otherwise just serve the person and move on. I don't think Jebus will mind if you serve a gay person or a republican.
 
Just for discussion sake, do you think it is ok for a Cake Maker to not provide a cake to a same sex couple? Do you think it is ok for a restaurant to deny service to someone because of their political affiliation?

My 2 cents, I think BOTH are okay. Freedom of speech blah blah blah. However that DOESN'T protect you from the repercussions (IE lost business, social media response, etc.). I get that this is a slippery slope and certainly opens the door to complete discrimination, but even given the current world climate of unmitigated hate, I still generally believe in people.
 
ugh justice kennedy's retiring.

Makes you wonder what landmark decisions will be reversed. This will be the most conservative court in over 75 years; we'll be lucky to see Brown v Board of Education stand, Dark times ahead for this country. :(
 
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/27/nyregion/alexandria-ocasio-cortez.html

I AM STOKED THAT MY GRRL ALEXANDRIA WON IN THE BRONX AND QUEENS!!! She is also a fellow Democratic Socialist of America...

The Bronx and Queens? At first I thought that couldn't be correct since the two don't share a land border but then I looked at the map for the district and the district does indeed cover portions of both those counties. Even though I don't know that I would call those areas contiguous the district is still relatively compact, but I guess any district in NYC would be thanks to the population density out there.

This isn't commentary other than I find it interesting that parts of the Bronx and Queens are in the same district. Looking at some more maps, it looks like NY 12 also includes parts of both Queens and Manhattan. While NY 7 includes parts of Brooklyn and Manhattan.
 
we'll be lucky to see Brown v Board of Education stand

Grow up, dude.

The Bronx and Queens? At first I thought that couldn't be correct since the two don't share a land border but then I looked at the map for the district and the district does indeed cover portions of both those counties. Even though I don't know that I would call those areas contiguous the district is still relatively compact, but I guess any district in NYC would be thanks to the population density out there.

This isn't commentary other than I find it interesting that parts of the Bronx and Queens are in the same district. Looking at some more maps, it looks like NY 12 also includes parts of both Queens and Manhattan. While NY 7 includes parts of Brooklyn and Manhattan.

Metro Atlanta has some weird looking districts like that if you equate our counties to NYC's boroughs.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Metro Atlanta has some weird looking districts like that if you equate our counties to NYC's boroughs.

We have some wakily drawn districts here in the Detroit area too but what struck me about those particular districts in NY is not so much that they cross county/borough lines but that they span across the East River to include portions of multiple islands (Long and Manhattan) or part of Long Island and part of the mainland (the Bronx - do people call that part of NY "the mainland"?) when they probably could have drawn the districts in such a way that they didn't need to cross over the East River and just been made up of parts of Brooklyn and the Bronx and/or Hempstead in Nassau County.
 
Back
Top